Identifying Grief with Shellee Zenteno

Every single one of us is grieving a loss; loss of self, loss of time, death, divorce, loss through addiction, job loss, broken heart, loss of trust, loss of a pet, loss by abandonment, loss of innocence, etc... especially now, during a global pandemic; layered losses. Grief is a natural part of our humanity that society misunderstands and too often dismisses, which unfortunately leads to unresolved, accumulated pain and unhealthy living patterns.

My (unfiltered) conversation with Shellee Zenteno, Grief Recovery Specialist, was recorded in 2021 but the tactical tips she provides in our conversation are simply timeless!

Don't wait any longer for help, hope, and healing! Shellee provides a safe and confidential environment to be heard and empowered. 
Time doesn’t heal, ACTION does.
*PM her for more information or text/call 843-619-5555

Know anyone who needs help?
Pass it on! 

Enjoy!!

Check out the links below for additional ways you can connect and stay updated on the meaningful and impactful work Shellee is doing. 
https://www.griefrecoverymethod.com/grms/shellee-zenteno

https://www.facebook.com/szgriefrecovery/

sz_grief.recovery.specialist

Transcript

You're listening to the SCV Connected podcast with my mom, Kelly O'Keefe.

Welcome to SCV Connected SCV Connected is a brand new podcast with a mission to connect all of us who call Santa Clarita home featuring small and local businesses while celebrating those doing meaningful and impactful work. 

I'm excited for you to listen to my conversation today with Shellee Zenteno. Her story opens by growing up in an abusive narcissistic alcoholic home. At the age of 20, she lost her mother to breast cancer, March, 2017. Her world exploded when she discovered her husband's body suddenly widowed with children. She had to start navigating a foreign world to create a new kind of beautiful for her family in pursuit of resolve. She became a certified grief recovery specialist.

Through the only evidence-based program, the grief recovery method.  Please welcome grief recovery specialist, Shellee Zenteno.  Take me to how you got started with this work in grief. Okay.  We all go through losses in life.  So I think like everybody, you know, I would go through losses.

I lost my mom when I was 20 to breast cancer in 2017, March 1st.  I suddenly lost my husband that that was pretty catastrophic. And, absolutely rocked my world.  We had been together for 28 years married almost 23.  I had no, no one else.  I went from my mom to him. He moved in with us when I was 16.

So. My whole life. I knew nothing else. I mean, he was just everything. He was my best friend. He was my person. I mean, he, and he was the person that I would go to whenever something bad happened. So when this happened, the person I was reaching for was the one who was gone and it was just,  I just, it was just despair, just absolute despair. Like I had never known before so bad that I was just like, how do people survive this feeling? Right? And his death was tragic.  He was one of those people that you would have never thought. That it would happen to, and he did suffer brain damage over the years and he had a degenerative brain disease.

And so there were a lot of individual factors that went into it, but nonetheless, it was shocking. It was not expected. And I was left with two children and not knowing how on earth I could possibly do this. So, you know, just kind of going through the shock and awe and all of just thinking I was in total ruin and.

It took a while. I went to a counselor for awhile, which was amazing. She was great, but I was just talking about the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, it wasn't until I had a friend that lost her husband, six months prior who had gone through this grief program.

And I was like, okay, well tell me about that. And she said, I think you'll really like it. So I went into the grief recovery method and I went through the program and then it was so. Eye opening and healing to me, I became, I became a specialist in it and started doing it myself because it gave me such an insight to grief and, and what it is and how it affects every loss that we have moving forward.

Uh, I had to grieve my mom and things in my childhood. Yeah. I was going to ask you that. So when you went into the grief recovery method group, did you. Did you work on the grief with your husband? Or did you work on a past grief? I worked on a past grief in order, really like to grieve my husband honorably.

I had to grieve other things. Like, he couldn't take responsibility for things that were not his responsibility. So I had to like grieve. So many things from my past of, you know, really losing my mom and then, you know, growing up in the childhood that I did and just, and how that shaped me to who I was and, and how kind of things went the way they did.

And it was a very big deal for me because, you know, to lose someone in the way I did with my husband, we take on. We feel like there's something that we could have done. They slipped through our fingers and this is my responsibility. And after going through the, all of this, I was like, this was not my fault.

People feel this all the time. People are losing people all the time, right? Especially  right now. I mean COVID.  And I think even  if someone goes through a divorce, you think  you know,  was it me, what did I do? Or if they betrayed you, what did I do? And, you know, you do all these things.

I mean, we just have these griefs that we put on ourselves and all of us go through it. And to be able to really kind of look at your life in grieve, what needs to be. Because grief is a cumulative. So as like I said, so when I agree, when I was grieving, my husband, I was grieving. What I didn't realize is I was grieving all the other losses in my life.

So, but when we're able to put things in this rightful place and grieve each event, grieve each, you know, loss of hope, strings and expectations along the way and how we wish things could have been different, better or more along the way when we're able to do that to each thing and its place. It's emptying the bucket.

 Let's talk about  grief when it comes to motherhood. There's so much, and I did not expect that.  There's so much change. Right. Well, you're, you're absolutely right. And I, when you were talking about how we visualize my son was class of 2020, and I remember, I think I was more upset about him not having a graduation than him not having a graduation because you know, in the hospital when you're holding them, you know, you've already, you've played their whole life.

Yes. In the days while you're in the hospital. I mean, he graduated in my mind, he got married and had children, you know, I mean, and so. He could have his graduation. I was like, You know, I knew he was disappointed for, I mean, there was no prom, there was no senior night and you know, all that was taken away.

And I remember one thing he said to me, cause I was so upset about the graduation. He's like, mom, this isn't about you. I'm like, well, yes it is right. Yes. No, totally. I'm like, you don't understand that this is my moment. I was just to be in the stands, watching you graduate away from me in every flashback.

Like every movie it's graduations, for sure. Like, you know, hearing the music and watching you walk down and turning the telecom. It's just, and, and there was completely out of my control. It was just taken and, you know, and obviously that was the story of many people, but it's just similar to kind of it's just losses.

Okay. So it's, that's grief too. It's not the death of someone. No, it's it's, you know, any significant emotional. It's the loss of hope. It's the loss of dream. It's the loss of expectation. Um, you know, someone can be assaulted and that is, you know, it could be a loss of their innocence and loss of trust. And, you know, and I think with a lot of the children and this grief of the whole pandemic, Global.

It's just global grief everywhere. All of us have experienced a sudden change in our life loss, fear, unpredictability. And,  it just happened instantly.  And we're not only feeling it ourselves. We're seeing our children have their normal taken away. Even if a kid was really happy to have be homeschooled for awhile.

I mean, at first my daughter was living the dream. Yeah. Because then there's almost that like grief of going back to reality, what reality was the new reality? Like. We as a world, we're such creatures of habit. And so, you know, school gets taken away and it's like, oh, what's happening? You know? And then, you know, like again, my daughter was kind of like, you know, oh, this is cool.

You know, I get to just wake up and be in my pajamas. And then after a while, like, okay. Even if you're more of an introvert with still. W there's a level, we are social creatures and to kind of go out and, and even when you're at school, there's little distractions that you don't realize.

There could be the little chatters, the bird chirping, there's things that are happening, you know, subconsciously if you're not really paying attention to  and, you're functioning well, when that's just gone, you're now you're in your room. It's gone all you have. Are your own thoughts because your brain never stops.

So now your thinking is, you know, the kids, you know, you're just thinking of just, I can't even imagine just the, everything that's happening, your future, you know, you start not seeing your friends that much anymore. There's nothing really to talk about with your friends. There's not, I mean, everything just starts dwindling and you know, the future.

Kind like sucks. Yeah, no, definitely. Your mind is like so powerful and sometimes you don't even know, like what's getting captive of it.

What you're watching, what you're doing, the loss of community and how like, just impactful. That is yeah, lots of community. And even though in grief, like we know, you know, we don't want to distract our grief, but there's normal things that we can do. Like if, if you want to go out and have a couple glasses of wine with your friend and laugh, you know, then you can do that.

Well now, Yeah. And maybe now we're starting to a little bit, but I mean, before, you know, over a year, it's like, no, you can't go to the. Right. You can't go to the concert. You can't like, there's nothing that you can normally do. In fact, you know, the gyms even closed and you can go out running and doing stuff, but then, then you have the psychological factor of seeing people with the masks and, have a friend who she's a psychologist and in the beginning, when she would walk into the store and see people with masks, it was just a problem for her.

Right. You know, so this is what was just so amazing about everything in this last year is it doesn't matter who you are. It doesn't matter if you're a neuropsychiatrist. It doesn't matter if you're a psychologist is doesn't matter. If you're a student, like we're all seeing. This total sun change in this, they psychology behind it of just like, we're all losing.

Yeah. So what can we do? Like what are there tactical things that we can do today? If we can't get an appointment with you tomorrow? You know what I mean? Like where can we start doing that work on our own. Well validated, validated, validated, you know, it is okay to say this absolutely sucks. We don't have to try to paint a silver lining.

We don't have to try to say, oh, but is it it's like, no, no, just say this just sucks. Okay. Now. And mad. And you know, if you're mad, say I'm mad, like this sucks. This was just totally not fair. And it doesn't matter what, life's not fair. So just stop right now. We're just going to, I'll be validated for the truth of the emotion, you know?

Yes. We have, you know, plagues in the world. Yes. Things will change incorrect as we know that, but right here, It just sucks. That's so powerful because yeah, I'll do that. I'll say it to myself, be all in Haiti that have it way worse. Kelly, you've been there. You've seen that, like buck up, come on, we start, we start doing the comparable and other people have it worse than, and again, that might be an intellectual truth, but.

It doesn't matter. You're then you still can say what I'm going through sucks. And that's another really good point that you, that you made of when we say someone else has a worst, because again, someone else could be looking at you and thinking what you're going through is their worse. Cause I mean, I would be like, cause I would do that initially.

Cause I would be thinking other people's going through it worst and you know, this may be really bad, but someone else might be looking at me and thinking, oh, that's my worst. No. It's okay to say, you know, right now this is my worst and you know, it sucks. So I think validated. Okay. And. Treat yourself as you would, your friend, that's such a good reminder, kind to yourself, patient, just say, Hey look, you know, I know all this intellectual truth.

Okay. But right now I'm just going to be really kind to myself. I'm going to be patient and I'm going to work really hard to be, kind to be patient with other people. Cause we're kind of all going through this and because we didn't just have the pandemic we've had. Okay. But like for how long should we be kind to ourself?

Because like, can I eat the chocolate for. 365 days or now ideally I would love to say yes, but it's of the being kind to yourself would mainly be, it doesn't necessarily have to mean eat the chocolate. It could mean really watch your self-talk. That is a huge thing for me because I expect myself to be at a different place.

I expect to be further ahead. I expect I have all these expectations and then I'm like, you know what? Just stop, you know, it's okay. There's just been all these setbacks, you know? It's the self-talk like, you're not a loser. You're okay. You know, it's just, I expect so much more being in my forties. So it's really just kind of watching how you speak to yourself.

And that's why I say, you know, treat yourself like you would a friend because you wouldn't say that to a friend. No, no way. No. So kind of see it as, as you would see to a friend and that really should be. Okay. And, but even more so it's more of a practice now to kind of get used to, you know, acting that way, um, and, and start making a game plan of actions of, you know, what, whether, whether you did a grief program to focus on your losses, or if it's something you want to do yourself, start kind of writing things down.

Walking it out everyone. And I would say not do it on your phone or computer. Oh really? Okay.  Uses a different part of your mind and, and it's just, it's just a different experience and, just start getting things out and you can write down what are you disappointed about? And then you can write, you know, what do, what are you hoping.

Four, because then we need to start also starting to incorporate the hope again, because it's the hope, it's where we kind of felt like, oh, this is hopeless. This is not forever. Yeah, exactly. You know? Yeah. I mean, I saw a commercial where it was for a movie and it said, you know, playing only in theaters, I'm like what theaters, right.

Is the only place I would stop. That's funny. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Oh my goodness. So it's like starting to kind of just, even if it seems completely unrealistic, I just start putting it down. Okay. You know, and indefinitely. I mean, I'm really all about getting help. I mean, if we take care of her cause minds and bodies, it all goes together.

 We get doctor checkups once a year and I say, do the mental checkup and like people so reluctant to go in and talk with a therapist or like a grief recovery specialist. I think we really believe that it's something we're supposed to just figure out on her own and. Yeah. In some cases that there are some things that are just kind of basic, but again, when you're talking about significant emotional losses, and if it's a cumulative, you gotta make sure that you're growing, you're working through the correct loss because you can't be working through, you know, if, if someone was going through a betrayal from their, a divorce in their marriage, but let's say they grew up.

And infidelity, if they grew up, you know, seeing their mother or father cheat, you know, you need to make sure, okay. Which let's make sure we're grieving. We're working through the right loss. Wow. Because you're the person who cheated on you and your marriage doesn't need to take responsibility for everything that happened in your childhood.

Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So, so make sure you're, you're putting things in its proper place. So. You're grieving the right loss and, and, you know, and when you do that, you can kind of see how you got yourself into certain situations, do like, yeah. So, and then this brings up this point of like, I remember this specifically happening in our grief group.

So, and especially like with loss of death, it's almost like you don't want to grieve it and go through it because you're letting that person go. And it's almost, if you're holding onto it, it's that blanket of comfort in a weird way. Does that happen in other types of grief too? Yes. And you feel like you're letting your in and that's, that's perfect.

Cause in the regards to like losing someone, you feel like if you're holding onto it and still holding onto that pain and feeling it you're it's, I dunno. It's just sometimes I think it's might be subconscious, but I think you feel like, well, I'm still keeping that person with me and I'm not forgetting them really.

If you could. Enjoy the memory of the person. And if you can work through it where you don't have to feel that pain and feel again, that twist of the knife, get the knife out because it's still going to be sad moments and it's still going to be, oh, I miss them. But to get the knife out where it's not twisting, where you can think of a happy times and you can really enjoy.

The memory of the person. So you're not really letting them go, you're letting go of the knife and the pain. And that would be the same thing. We're kind of comes to maybe forgiveness of a situation. If something, there was an event or something happened and you need to move through that, sometimes we hold onto it because we're thinking, well, if I forgive them that I'm letting them off the hook.

Oh, totally. Yes. Yeah. I mean, that was my thing with forgiveness cause we know intellectually that forgiving is about. Your freedom, not their freedom, but  I still can't. I had a hard time making that same cause I feel like, well, if I forgive them, I'm somehow condoning that or accepting that or saying, okay, it's all right.

No, it's no. And that's where you kind of say, okay, I acknowledge for whatever reason, XYZ happened. For me to let go of that, so I can experience, you know, a little bit more happy in my life, because if things are full, if you're full, you don't have room for the other good stuff.

Oh, that's so good. That's, you know, you gotta, like, I always say, you know, we have, we have our bucket and we gotta keep emptying our bucket because things are going to still come at ya. So if it starts getting too full, two things happen. One when bad stuff happens, you overflow and hemorrhage just have emotional.

Oh, yes. Or you can't allow any good in, so you just, and then that just bounces off because you get bitter and, or you just trust or you, you know, you're walking on eggshells, you're waiting for the next shoe to drop. And so you gotta just kind of keep emptying the bucket along the way.  I mean, I'm still emptying my bucket.

I'm going to be my bucket probably for the rest of my life, because there's always going to be something and or something that will remind me. Uh, but I have the tools now. I'm not just walking around with a paintbrush, trying to, you know, build additions to my home. Yeah, no, that's so powerful that you went back and you continue to do the work because I remember when we sat in group, you know, towards the end, we were all just like, almost like lighter feeling.

As I started to work through the grief and the guy leading the grief specialist, he just said, you know, most of you probably won't go back to the book. Like you'll leave the class and like, You know, like you won't reopen the book and start on a new grief, which is that's the goal. But until you have that accountability, In that group setting.

And so, yeah, I've never opened the book ever since. And I'm like, I maybe, you know, I love group work and I do a lot of, most of what I do is one-on-one when they go through the course, it's, you know, we go through that, we go through the grief and we, you know, grieve the, you know, event or person or situation that they grieve on, but it's also teaching them.

Okay. So what this is, this is what. Because it's to teach you how to keep doing this through not just up to now. As we go through things along the way, because you know, you could lose a job along the way, you know, that's going to go like, ah, and then you're going to have to work through that. So it's just, it's giving, it's giving the tools in the toolbox, what age?

Cause like I have a three and six year old. Are they. To me. It's like, well, they don't know any, uh, anything else. So yes, yes. And they're grieving. They're grieving like a little child if they get their favorite ice cream and they're so excited cause they couldn't wait to have that ice cream and they're walking and they stumble and the ice cream falls that's for them.

That's an emotional loss, you know, they cry. So like we see them crying the third real ice cream thinking. Okay, seriously, you know, but to them they're like, Yeah. So yeah, when they can't see their friends or just, things are different, they're not going to school. Yeah. They're, they're grieving in their own way.

And that's why it's really important that we let them voice that and let them be frustrated. And, um, but you know, it's then, like we talked about before, you know, kind of re-engaging them of, okay. Yeah, absolutely. So what are we going to do about that? What are we going to do from here? You know, you're right.

This, this is yucky. You know, yo, what do you think would make it less? You know, and then listen to them, let them kind of talk.  I work with,  18 and over, but I do think it is very important to, uh, anxiety is huge. Um, you know, suicide is the second leading cause of. Among our youth and you have children, you know, as young as 10 and five and seven, I mean, it's, it's horrific.

So it's really important to pay attention, to okay, to the behaviors of children and not just discount it, just pay attention and get them into, you know, professional help to have someone listen to them. And no one knows your child, like, you know, your child. What if the kid's not showing any behavior differences, but you know, there has to be some sense of grief during the season.

Does it hurt to reach out, just plug them in to help, just to see, get the counselor's perspective or the grease special, like get them some sort of help, second opinion to validate. Maybe they are handling upgrades. Yeah, I inform it kinda like coaching. Just say, you know, we're in, go talk to someone, kind of like a coach.

We're just going to kind of see how things are going.  It's very difficult to force teens and older kids to get help. Uh, it just like, you know, they're like us, you know, you can't. Make them do something, you know, your five-year-old, you can, you know, your 17 year old, it's just a lot different if you're noticing something different with your child.

And they're just more isolating and they're not talking as much, they're not talking about the future and they're having anger, outbursts, and just something just sings up. It doesn't mean that they're, you know, in a dark place, but if they're also not expressing and talking to you, Then it's not going to hurt.

Just, just to go, just, just go see someone and have them check and there's nothing wrong. People are so afraid to ask the questions that they're kids they're afraid because like, oh, well I don't want to put anything into their head. Well, if they're already in a dark place, you're not putting anything into their head.

And is the parent when you're, um, Mother's watching your children hurt. Uh, you know, again, no matter what it is, so, you know, they, they didn't get into the college they wanted, or they got a breakup with their boyfriend or their girlfriend. I mean, just knowing I can't fix this, feel it right.

This is, it's just so horrible. I think even now, I mean, I think my opinion. I always feel like I can handle my stuff. It's watching kids. Yes. That was just the worst of the worst. And because that's what it is as a parent, when your children go through the pain, but it comes down to then that's our role to teach them how to work through that pain, to teach them how to treat.

Gain power from those emotions and in a positive way. And, and, and that's where we can go in where, where we can do something. What can we do? Let's teach them how to work through it. You know, let's teach them how to use the tools in the toolbox.  I feel so empowered just personally with my own health, after our conversation, but just like as a mother, too, and as a friend, as a member of the community, just to take responsibility.

In this aspect of health and it's okay. And again, it's okay to stumble. I stumble all the time. I mean, it just happens and it's just taking the edge off into say, okay, you fall, then you just, you get back up. And sometimes you might be down a little bit longer and, but just get up and just keep going. Just keep going.

It's important that we don't sit in a victimhood. And even though we might be a victim of a circumstance or whatever it is. Okay. That's fair. But we don't have to sit in that. And  that's not your identity. You're in your identity is so much more empowering and, and fruitful from that. All right.

Thank you so much for your time today. I really appreciate it. You're welcome back. Anytime, because we're always working through grief. There's always something there is. And I have a feeling, you know, we're all, even as we. Start re-engaging. Yeah. Well, I mean, think about the people who have lost their businesses, right.

That they're in their 50, some people were getting ready to retire and I can't even imagine. There's not like you're now having to start over in your fifties and like it's, it's kind of strong. It's absolutely catastrophic. And that is a huge, huge loss on so many different levels. So I mean, that's grief.

So I think as we start, you know, continuing on this, you know, journey of pandemic recovery we're grieving. 

In recapping my conversation today with Shelley, . The work that she is doing really has the power to change a community. Shelly is a perfect example of making your mess, your message. There's nothing more important to her than, than this work in this space.  I'm just so thankful that we live in a community where Shelly lives.  This is just a gentle reminder and a nudge  slow down, pay attention to those around you, pay attention to the impact that the world is having on. You pay attention to the people in your home and your spaces and your community.

Thank you for listening to SCV Connected 📍  today.